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DIY - Continuous Ink Systems
Fri, 2007-03-09 17:42 — udijw
Some how, back in February of 2006, I found out about Continuous Ink Systems (CIS) and begin my search. I came across a man selling what I deemed to be a good system to try on E-Bay, and through a few emails, discovered he lived just up the street from me. I bought my first CIS from him within a week.
A CIS supplies "phony" cartridges with ink continuously from large reservoirs out side the printer with silicon tubing. The average home printer cartridge holds only 8-15ml of ink, and the CIS I bought comes pre loaded with 100ml of ink in each color container. That’s a lot of cartridges worth of ink!
I took a chance getting this system as I realized this very important truth. The Ink cost as much as the printer, so I am only out the cost of the CIS, as the printer is pretty much disposable. It is a bloody shame, but true for most entry level photo printers.
Just read some of the replies to this site, that claims someone did the math, and realized that if one were to fill an Olympic sized swimming pool with ink from cartridges, it would cost 5.9 BILLION DOLLARS!
Some of the replies are:
Just Buy a New One by Ryan on Feb 6th, 2007 @ 6:12am
I just bought a new printer instead of buying ink.
It was cheaper.
Yeah, I threw away a perfectly good printer, but hey... I'll be throwing away another perfectly good printer in a couple months when it runs out of ink too. Saves me about $20 that way.
How long until our landfills are nothing but piles of working printers?By Overcast on Feb 6th, 2007 @ 7:32am
We bought a 25$ Ink Jet Printer
- Took one look at the price of Ink for it - and went to Staples and bought a Laser Jet the day it ran out of ink.
Anyhoo - I have refilled it 5 times now, and have printed almost 2000 full color almost full page 8.5 x 11 highest quality prints on high resolution ink jet paper, and over 300 8.5 x 11 borderless glossy photo prints.
Believe me when I tell you each new photo print looks like the first. Bright crisp, sharp and colorful. Totally awesome black levels and blinding colors!!
I own an Epson R200 printer, which prints on CDs and DVDs as well. (I actually own and operate 2- R200s, one Epson CX7800 all in one and a larger format 13" wide Epson 1280). I purchased a CIS for the 1280, and get stunning 13" x 19" photos, and made some breath taking 13" x 30" panoramic. (Using a roll feeder) see my setup in the picture below
Mine is an isobarically balanced system, requiring no priming or needles. It’s a 5 minute set up.
I believe I have saved over $2000.00CAD between my 3 printers so far.
A note about the ink- The Epson R200/300 series and the 1280 use Dye ink. It is not waterproof, and may not last longer then 10-15 years without fading. The CX7800 uses Durabrite ink, which is pigment based and is archival- 50+ years, water resistant, fade resistant. This archival ink is very expensive, and hard to come by in bulk. So if you are happy with a print that is truly photo quality, but may not last forever, the CIS is for you.
For text, it is actually cheaper than a laser printer. Probably less than one cent worth of ink per page. It is a photo printer, so I suggest the use of a laser printer if all you do is text. They are built to last longer, and fewer moving parts.
The shop that sells CIS for Epson printers here in the GTA is http://www.asc365.com/
Feel free to contact me via e-mail for any questions. These systems sell on the internet and on eBay for under $100. The replacement ink is about $10 per 100ml/colour. Using high quality photo paper available in bulk (150 sheets for $22.00) at Costco for .15¢ per sheet, add less then .15¢ for the ink and you have an 8x10/ 8.5 x 11 for only .30¢!!! (2- 5" x 7" for .15¢ each or 3- 4"x6" for .10¢ each)
If you buy a brand new printer for $129 and a CIS for $79, your first 300 full page photos on photo paper cost only .84¢ each. That’s a sweet deal compared to some places that want $5 for an 8x10. Even Wal-Mart and Costco here in Toronto want $2.99.
Here are some shots of my Epson R200 hooked up. Hope this helps... Rudi
Here is a shot of me holding a picture I took and printed of my brother in laws wedding on my 1280 printer.
I am standing in front of another picture I printed and had plaqued. I figure the large pictures cost me maybe forty cents in ink. The paper I have I got on sale for forty five cents. I buy generic paper made in Toronto for about a dollar sixty otherwise. Still, under two bucks for a 13 x 19!
So you see that at least having cartridges refilled is not just cost effective, but environmentally responsible as well.
Let me tell you the joy I have now being able to print to my hearts content and not worry about ink cartridges. Thanks to stores like Costco, by paper supply is inexpensive as well. I get a thrill
Every time a full page 8.5" x 11" photo rolls off the printer at a cost of less then .35¢. Even Costco and Wal-Mart charge $2.99 for an 8x10! THIS IS BIG NEWS!!
My 13" x 19" prints cost me under $2.00 if I buy paper at club prices (http://ccbc-club.com) and I scored some paper for under .50¢ per sheet so I am under a buck for a large print!
Darn! This is not rocket science - it is down to earth economics! Do you want to pay $100 for a new set of cartridges or $80 for 10 sets of equivalent ink?
* March 4th update - 2007 To date I have helped 3 friends get CIS and 2 more have just bought Epson printers and are ready to be hooked up.
This article was contributed by Rudi Jock - who in additions to his photographic skills - sees the "big picture" and helps save money on the final printed image. He also has a great website, and here is the direct link to his CIS page.
Make money by selling your pictures
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Comments
Archival ink
Thanks for the great article. I have an R300, and I have been wondering how well this works. I've been a little shy after having mixed results with 3rd party replacement cartridges, but now I think I may give it a try.
One thing you did not mention was the costs and potential sources for the archival ink. I'd appreciate a follow up with info on your results with that printer.
Archival ink prices.
I have only found one supplier of Archival Ink here in Canada, so far,
and am not happy with the price.
Even with shipping, tax and duty paid, the ink from www.inksupply.com
is much cheaper.
The only thing I have noticed is there is no distinguishing between
Epsons Durabrite and Durabrite Ultra.
I have not hesitated using the one type in an Ultra printer,
as I believe the only difference is the drying time.
www.inksupply.com has a few different sizes of ink, but so far I have
noticed (at least for my printers and a couple of friends Canon printers) a
constant $10 per 4oz (100ml) bottle.
This is a good idea. It
This is a good idea. It keeps you ink levels so high that you never have to worry about watching the ink levels. It is true that the cost of inks are more expensive than the printers some times. The market of printers is primarily concerned with three things, inks, papers, and printers. This makes sense because it is these things that attribute to the final output. I can see why some would rather buy a new printer, but this is absurd and the thought of people just getting new printers when their ink runs out is just as absurd.
The benefit of continuous ink system is quite obvious, but I question its capabilities for the person who seeks quality over quantity. Dye inks are still widely used today. So think about this, the printer companies have a business model that offers consumers an affordable printer with semi-affordable inks. The dye ink is cheap and they will make the cost of manufacturing the printer back by selling inks and special papers for a higher price. So users are stuck buying expensive inks unless they purchase generic cartridges, refill kits, or continuous ink systems to help save some cash. Sounds like a reasonable theory, wouldn't you say?
These alternatives are great for people who want to get the best bang for their buck. Really good quality and with low costs from buying in bulk. However, for those who have spent the moolah on a more expensive printer, these alternatives are not feasible. You have said that the availability of archival inks is quite low; that is probably true. However, your article does not acknowledge the people who demand the type of quality that a low to mid range dye-based ink-jet cannot offer.
High-range printers offer more control over how the output is processed, which in turn saves ink and increases quality. Though the "archival inks" are far more expensive in contrast to dye-based inks, more than likely the printers that use them are expensive too. This may not necessarily mean that the printers engineering is top-notch, (for that would be absurd for me to say that more expensive things are better), but in all truth, a person typically gets what they pay for. The Epson Stylus 4800 Pro offers 110ml and 220ml cartridges. You will not find these inks for $10, but what you sacrifice in price you gain in quality. From my own observations, the Stylus 4800 Pro's ink cartridges lasted approximately 3-5 months in a low-medium use (college) setting. The ink usage was not consistent, especially for a printer that has 8 different inks. Some prints may have higher levels certain colors --- so it makes sense that some inks would be used faster than others. This is up to the user to fix, not the printer.
What ink usage boils down to is the experience of the user, the type of paper being used, and the equipment being used. Sure you can buy a large reservoir to hold inks, but it does not attempt to answer "WHY DOES THIS PRINTER USE SO MUCH INK?" If your car used more gas than usual, would you simply buy a bigger gas tank? More than likely, you would try to locate the problem. Maybe it was something you did? Maybe something is wrong with the car? Maybe I need a better car?
CIS in Europe
A professional photographer acquaintance of mine says that Epson manufactures CIS systems and markets them in Germany. He told me that you can walk into a print shop similar to a Kinko's Copies (here in Toronto) and not just have the use of photo copiers but the use of quality ink jet printers as well. He says there are large bottles of ink on the walls providing the printers via an array of tubing. He asked about this and found out that it is genuine Epson ink and that the system was provided by Epson. He inquired directly with Epson, and was told that the existence of such systems would be denied here in North America. How is that for a kick in the teeth. I will go on record and stand trial for slurring the name of Epson for robbing the people of hard earned money by selling the ink cartridges at ridiculously high profit margin and great ecological irresponsibility by not providing an alternative.
Shame on you Epson.
As for the last post "why does the printer use so much ink?" There is an answer (aside from the obvious,a big photo quality print needs a lot of ink)- Its called ICC profiles. The printer companies try their best to provide profiles for the different types of paper (plain, bright, glossy, matte etc.) but this only goes so far. Like a car, we can improve "millage or gas usage" by using engine additives, better tires or controlling speeding. With a profile, you can tell the printer EXACTLY the right amount of ink to use on a certain type of paper to get the ultimate print. These profiles can save money by cutting down on ink usage substantially. However like additives or high performance tires, these profiles are costly. In the mean time, if you are going to drive, you need to buy gas. What station do you shop at?
CIS
I have been using a CIS on my Epson 1270 since I bought the printer new in 04. The printer has printed well in excess of 2,000 images and aside from a few failures, most have been sucessful. Even after the 2 year old decided to unplug poppa's ink tubes (dont ask about the floor). I got mine from inkjetart.com and I have to refill the bottles once although they are getting near a refill again. Nowdays, they have pigment based CIS systems which I would probably look at for any new printer. Mine is dye based and the MIS dye has been very good in matching and life time fading. But then I coat all my good prints for any dye based ink. I did a run of several hundred prints for my oldest daughter when she got back from France and was the "starving teenager". Between the microcoated paper and the CIS, her prints ran about .04 (FOUR CENTS) each. Yah, she spent some time cutting them up but it was alot cheaper than paying any website to print them.
I have my 1 epson r200
I have my 1 epson r200 printer from nearly 3 years ago on the same CIS. and i printed nearly 12,000 pages from it and it works like the day i bought it. I get higher quality ink from a guy down the road 8 bucks per 100ml the colors are so much richer and the smell could knock you out it is so strong. but people look at the pics and can't believe i printed them on my printer and that it was cheaper then anywhere else
Epson 200 Settings
Hi,
I just bought the CIS from asc365. I am finding the colours are not quite right based on their recommended settings. What settings are you using to print on Epson Glossy Paper?
Thanks
HP999
My CIS Solution
I to have been circumventing the ink cartridge problems since the early HP black and white Deskjet days. I started my early work on the CIS systems back in late 2005. I originally ordered a sample system for a Epson C86 from a Japanese wholesaler to test and see how the system worked. There were problems with connections, tubing, and mostly the quality of the ink that was supplied with the system. I have continued to work with the CIS (continuous ink system) over the years till now and have been rewarded with an excellent system with no functional problems and excellent ink. I use both a cheap Epson (C88) and a mid range (R260). The system that I use (CIS) comes from Kyson (kyson.yangportal.com) because I can depend on its quality and mostly because of the quality of the ink that is supplied both with the unit and which can be ordered separately. I have used the C88 for over 18 months and it has never clogged or given me any problems whatsoever. The R260 (six color CIS) has been in operation almost 12 months, again with absolutely no problems. I use the dye ink, not the pigmented, since I am not interested in long term storage as relates to color. I do extensive printing of software manuals which I read at my leasure and also keep handy for reference. (use a software package called Clickbooks which allows me to print nice manuals on all sides of the paper and saves space, paper, and ink) I am pretty sure that all the Big Three Printer manufacturers (Epson, Canon, HP) all manufacture their ink tolerances such that they produce good results, but at the same time necessitate that the print head constantly purge and clear/clean themselves, this of course wastes much of the small quantity of ink that you pay so much for in the individual or combination cartridges. It is a very lucrative business for them. However with my current system, I have noticed almost nonexistant purging and or cleaning of the heads and excellent printout even after extended periods of nonuse of the printer. I believe the CIS systems also work better on the Epson printers and not so well on the HP and Lexmark. The main difference is that the cartridge for the Epson has a shutoff valve which is not activated until the cartridge is loaded into the printer, and this controls better the flow of ink overall than say the HP type which has the printhead in the cartridge. This however is just my point of view. I have never had good luck with HP and a CIS system over time. Cost of a simple system is well under $200 and pays for itself in about 2 cartridge refills for all colors or less. Cost of Epson C88 $49.00 plus $67.00 for CIS system. The R260 or C120 cost are slightly higher. Need help or suggestions call 317-536-8127 on your dime and I will be glad to help or advise. gwooster@comcast.net
problem with CIS
We ordered a CIS for our Canon Pixma 4500 printer. Installed it, printed a few prints, printed nicely. Went home for the evening. Came back to work the next day, the pigment black tank was only half full while the other tanks remained full. The black ink leaked out into the bottom of our printer. Thought it was a cracked cartridge. The company we ordered from sent a new cartridge. Upon waiting for the new cartridge, we covered the cartridges with the hard plastic cases they came in. The pigment black ink never stopped flowing. The tank is almost empty now and the ink is all over the box it came in. Still no problems with the other cartridges. Noticed that the black ink tube is solid black with no air bubbles in it. The others have air bubbles in them. Whick is normal? Now we have to change the black cartridges out, but what if the ink doesn't stop flowing? I can't easily get in touch with the company that we bought this system from. Can anyone help me with this?
Thanks,
Blake
Epson d92 with cis
Can you tell me if I can use a cis with epson d92 and how to install please?
Replacing in cartridges is
Replacing in cartridges is still cheaper on the long run and saves the environment too.
ink
i have bought a ciss for the epson d92 it is filled with pigment ink can i add dye ink to this without any bad reactions in my printing
ink cartridges not recognized
I love having the CIS because it saves so much money on ink and I don't have boxes of the empty cartridges to deal with, but I have some problems. First of all I get a message that says the ink cartridges are not recognized and I have to fool around taking them out and putting them back in several times to get it to come off of that error message and start working again. Maybe there is something else I should be doing but I don't know what it is.
I also have the problem of the ribbon hanging into my prints and leaving a little trail of scratches. I have a barely perceptible amount of play in my ribbon. If it's too taut it makes a horrible chattering noise and can kick it into the ink cartridges not recognized message. Or if it's too loose the carriage for the cartridges have gotten caught on the ribbon with the same horrible noise and error message. Right now I have to stand at the printer and every time it pulls taut at the farthest end I pull the ribbon up a little so it doesn't hang down in my print. I have to do this several times during printing. I'm not happy with this at all. Does anyone else have these problems?? Help!!
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